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Declare Independence, by Martha Thomases – Brilliant Disguise | @MDWorld

July 6, 2013 Martha Thomases 6 Comments

1013837_695532507140492_2009430221_nI don’t know what to think about this week’s events in Egypt.  On the one hand, the people (mostly) peaceably assembled to express their displeasure with the government.  On the other hand, the government they were protesting was democratically elected.  On the other hand, it was a theocratic government systematically denying rights to women and other minorities.  On the other hand, I don’t like it when the military deposes a government.  On the other hand, it seems as if the Muslim Brotherhood is now discredited.  On the other hand, this might allow the success of an even more extreme party.

As you can see, even counting my feet and all of my cat’s paws, we are rapidly running out of hands here.

 

 

As an American celebrating Independence Day all weekend, I appreciate the fact that I live in a more or less democratic society.  Yeah, the Supreme Court has determined that corporations are people, and money can sway the stupid, and the stupid get to vote, but that’s what democracy means.  At its best, this situation forces us to get along.

At its worst, it is the House of Representatives in 2013, where it is considered a mark of honor to hold to one’s principles (which consist mostly of obstructing Obama) to the point that nothing whatsoever gets done..

Similar to our own Tea Party candidates in 2010, Morsi was elected to make some sense out of the economy, and instead spent his energies on his socially conservative agenda.  The protests sprang up because the Egyptian economy did not improve.

I’m still not sure his ouster is a good thing.

It’s easy for those of us in the West to tut-tut the behavior of other countries that don’t have our advantages of wealth and the free exchange of ideas.  It’s also easy to be condescending, to overlook bad behavior in the name of “cultural” differences.

Denying one’s fellow citizens basic rights and protections under the law is not a cultural difference. It’s an offense against freedom and liberty.

My mother, in her capacity as a member of the ACLU (as well as being my mother) taught me that the mark of a democracy is not that everyone gets to vote, or that the person with the most votes wins, but that the rights of the minorities are protected.  I did not know this idea did not come from her, but from others. Still, it makes sense to me, and not just because it was my mom.  As Digby says:

“Democracy and constitutional liberalism are not interchangeable ideas, any more than democracy and free markets are. Constitutional liberalism with protections for women and minorities, equality under the law, freedom of speech and worship, and all the other benefits we associate with modern democracies do not necessarily arise from democracy. These things must be built and enacted piece by piece–often in spite of the majority will of citizens.”

There are all kinds of crazy laws that would be on the books if the will of the (voting) majority was the only thing that mattered.  I have no doubt that we would have a national religion, mandatory prayer in schools, and no minimum wage, workplace protection or food safety laws, and no laws against sexual harassment in the workplace.

It is my opinion (or at least, my hope) that we enjoy the freedoms that we have, and appreciate the struggles of those who put their lives on the line for them, even in the face of opposition from those in authority, here and abroad.

Here’s hoping that Egypt has a chance to experience the same freedoms we enjoy.  In fact, here’s hoping they learn from our examples and show us how to do it better.

Martha Thomases, Media Goddess, lives in a city where the mayor thinks sparklers are a bad thing.  Sparklers!

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Comments

  1. Howard Cruse
    July 6, 2013 - 7:18 am

    Will the new leaders in Egypt add a Bill of Rights to their constitution? Hard to imagine. Would today’s Republicans allow the current Bill of Rights to be added to our constitution if it weren’t there already? Not a chance.

    I’m really glad the founding fathers slipped it in up front.

  2. Mike Gold
    July 6, 2013 - 8:24 am

    The problem with a democracy is that the people can democratically elect a tyrant, like our Wicked Uncle Adolf. Sometimes, the people democratically elect somebody that is not in America’s perceived best interest. That’s why we have the CIA.

    Now, I’m not saying the CIA is behind the current Egyptian upheaval or has contributed to it in some material way — but, given their track record, it would be imbecilic to rule that out.

    I think it’s America’s place to leave it the hell alone and let the Egyptians decide what’s best for Egypt… and be prepared to accept the consequences.

  3. George Haberberger
    July 6, 2013 - 9:45 am

    “There are all kinds of crazy laws that would be on the books if the will of the (voting) majority was the only thing that mattered.”

    I am constantly reminded of a Winston Churchill quote: “The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.”

    Would today’s Republicans allow the current Bill of Rights to be added to our constitution if it weren’t there already? Not a chance.

    This is fun. Let me try. Would today’s Democrats approve of the 9th and 10th amendment, to say nothing of the 2nd? Given their dessire to be in charge of everything, probably not. But maybe they would. I am not so presumptuous to assume I know what people think.

    It is always amusing when someone uses their opinion to presume facts not in evidence. It reminds me of what I said here:

    https://mdwp.malibulist.com/2013/02/golddigger-by-martha-thomases-brilliant-disguise-mdworld/

    It is equally entertaining to read a description, or more accurately, denigration, stated as though it were a fact, of a group for which the writer has an admitted animus. It is similar to asking the Capulets what they think of the Montegues or what Javert thinks of Jean Valjean or Lex Luthor’s opinion about Superman. In such cases I always consider that the source has abrogated any presumption of open mindedness and so I factor that into my evaluation.

  4. Rene
    July 6, 2013 - 10:54 pm

    George,

    It’s wise to listen to your enemies too, not only to your friends. Your friends usually see your good aspects only, your enemies aren’t shy about shouting your imperfections out loud. In other words, Lex Luthor may have some interesting insights about Superman. But I know that few people or groups have the courage for brutal self-evaluation. And certainly not Conservatives. Self-doubt is for whiney Liberals, right?

    And when it comes to countries? It’s even better to listen to the enemy. Communists have always been right about the dirtier things America has done, just as Americans have always been right about the oppressive nature of Communist countries. You certainly gets a sharper, clearer picture then you’d get if you listened to the country’s own self-aggrandizing propaganda.

  5. Martha Thomases
    July 7, 2013 - 6:17 am

    I’m with this kid: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/07/06/ali-ahmed-egypt-excoriates-muslim-brotherhood-video_n_3555093.html?utm_hp_ref=fb&src=sp&comm_ref=false

    Clearly, he is better educated than most of us, and seems able to reason. I mean, if he’s just parroting things his parents say (in which case, I want to invite his parents to my next dinner party), he still has the verbal elasticity to respond to any question presented, based on evidence.

  6. Whitney
    July 8, 2013 - 10:37 am

    Democracy is an imperfect system. Many wish that it was sacred and therefore beyond correction, but history doesn’t support this.

    At best, it defines a minimum standard of human interaction that is required to let people live out their higher moral convictions. As in I want to love others as myself, but the law only requires me to not kill them.

    At worst, Nazi Germany. And I strongly support a revolt against a democratically elected group such as this. The sooner the better, before they can get entrenched.

    Egypt? Not sure about Morsi. But whoever speaks against Israel the way he has has got something wrong in all the places that it matters. And I have friends there who haven’t been able to leave their house for awhile and are hoping their food doesn’t run out.

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